Fort Oglethorpe Police chief suspended through Nov. 23
By Rachel Brown
Wednesday November 14, 2007 12:57:42pm


Fort Oglethorpe Police Chief Larry C. Black has been suspended without pay for 10 days.

Interim City Manager and City Attorney Ron Goulart said he suspended Black on Tuesday for not following his orders to investigate a complaint and for sending a memo within his department criticizing the mayor and a council member.

“I hope it gets his attention,” Goulart said.

Goulart said Fort Oglethorpe resident Harvey Hogue had complained that officer Tammy Higgins was harassing him and shouldn’t have cited him for wearing his seat belt because he had it on. Hogue has been pulled over by Higgins several times before, officials said.

Goulart said he asked Black to investigate the matter, but shortly after that, Black instead sent a request through his lawyer asking for paid vacation. Goulart approved it and completed the investigation himself.

Black had also sent a memo to several city officials and employees criticizing Mayor Judd Burkhart and Council Member Louis Hamm for siding with Hogue and signing a petition asking Fort Oglethorpe police officers to stop harassing citizens. Burkhart and Hamm said they signed only a petition acknowledging they had heard Hogue’s complaint.

Goulart said the memo was copied to several the news media representatives, although he did not know for cer-tain who sent it.


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bygracethrufaith
Comments: 1272
Joined: 07/13/2007
11/27/2007 09:24:15 AM
jaydubya....
yes there is a smell...and it's pretty nauseating.

saw some footage of the council meeting on TV....saw where Mr. Mayor would not allow the folks to speak - heard he has always had an "open mic" policy...guess he decided that his last couple of meetings would not include that.....also wondering: Concerning Chief Black-Doesn't a loss of pay result in a "reduction of Salary"? If my salary is $XXXX.XX per month and I loose one week's worth of that, has my pay not been "reduced?"
All of this city charter stuff, and personel policy books REALLY need to be modified...seems that every loophole we can think of has been found in the past couple of months. ***Including the one where you can be pulled over with a DUI and walk away with your license intact, no blemish on your driving record at all....plus the city gets MUCH more money than they would have from that measely little DUI fine...Everyone wins, right? Everyone exept the next person/people that are in front of that 2nd offense drunk driver that ducked out of getting thier license suspended and decides to just get in the car and do it again...wonder how many accidents have been caused be repeat offenders whose driving record did not reflect as so, just because their charges were reduced or even dropped?
(putting my gas mask back on now...lol)
 
jaydubya
Comments: 192
Joined: 11/05/2006
11/27/2007 03:24:08 AM
Why has Chattanoogan.com already printed a story about Mr. Black being denied an appeal, before the board of comissioners, before CCN has it on their blog site? Seems strange. Why are somefolks afraid of someone talking. What is said can't be as scary as what is not said. When someone is not allowed to speak up then someone is trying to cover something up. Is there a huge smell coming form the FO area? Or are things just heating up? Bet someone is not getting their Christmas bonus this year. But then look who was ousted from office. Maybe the new folks will let people speak up.

 
ringgoldone
Comments: 615
Joined: 07/24/2006
11/23/2007 11:32:59 PM
That would be the story as it was printed. Talk to Officer Moore.

I don't recall that Cobb has made any comments about the DUI's in print, but verbally is another thing. It just seems very convenient that now we find out about all these DUI's being reduced. It would be nice to know what the real DUI rate is since Cobb made his "business decision" (his words) to open Fort O to beer and wine sales.

And all of this did happen while he was on the council.

Didn't mean to offend with Hitler, but it is important for us to remember what happens when power hungry men get absolute power. Power corrupts; absolute powrt corrupts absolutely.
 
bygracethrufaith
Comments: 1272
Joined: 07/13/2007
11/23/2007 10:46:15 PM
1/12/04 Catoosa County News Archive:

Traffic ticket fixed?

Councilman Cobb said certain council members want Blevins removed from his position because they claim he fixed a traffic ticket for Cobb’s son, Ty.

“What they told their internal people was that he fixed a ticket for my son or had something to do with a ticket for my son, which is a total lie,” Cobb said.

The controversy stems from an incident Nov. 2, 2003, when Ty was pulled over by officer Mitchell Moore on Battlefield Parkway for having an expired Tennessee tag on his vehicle, according to the police report. In the report, it states that Moore did not issue a ticket after Ty informed the officer that the truck was a new purchase, and he had all the paperwork on the vehicle at home. Moore notes in the report that during a previous incident Blevins had also allowed Cobb to avoid charges.

In the report, Blevins states that during a meeting with Moore he explained to the officer that the previous incident, referenced in his report, occurred in Chattanooga, and Ty could not have been charged in Fort Oglethorpe.

According to the report of that incident, which occurred in February 2003, a Chattanooga police officer in an unmarked car observed Ty driving erratically and followed him to Cloud Springs Road in Fort Oglethorpe where he called local authorities. The report states that Ty passed a field sobriety test given by Fort Oglethorpe police and was released. The report goes on to state the Chattanooga officer said he was unsure if he would pursue charges for the traffic violations, which occurred in Chattanooga.

Blevins said it is up to an officer’s discretion on whether or not to issue a ticket, and anyone, no matter who their relative is or who they are, is subject to the law.

“For somebody to say I fixed a ticket for a relative of a politician is absolutely ridiculous,” Blevins said last week. “It’s absolutely a lie.”


ringgoldone: is this what you are talking about or is there a real DUI that you are speaking of?
I know, CCN has been threatened with a lawsuit by Cobb-according to what you said before, therefore they don't print bad things about him, so perhaps they arranged this story to suit him without telling the REAL truth. I understand the concept of not believing everything that you read/see/hear, but it looks as if the folks that are getting away with DUI's around here most likely aren't tied to the city in any way. They just seem to have enough money on them to plea the lesser charge and get the DUI charges reduced to "reckless conduct" which is NOT EVEN a traffic violation. In other words...pay the city big bucks and you get to walk away with your license and insurance still intact. Then hop in your car and do it again...That has been happening under the CURRENT administration. I find it very strange that something happens that reflects badly on the current city officials and you begin talking about Cobb, as if this incident has something to do with him.

surely you aren't implying that Cobb has anything to do with all of these tickets being fixed/dismissed- to support his claims that DUI's have not increased? - I would like to see when he said that, I saw someone on here say it...but have not heard or read that Cobb has made that statement (not saying he hasn't).

quoting Adolf Hitler? wow. i'd really rather not hear what he had to say...
 
ringgoldone
Comments: 615
Joined: 07/24/2006
11/23/2007 05:16:03 PM
Don't forget that mayor-elect Cobb got a DUI on his son Ty swept under the rug (no charge at all!) while he was on the council.

And of course, all these reductions of DUI's helps to support Cobb's claims that DUI's have not increased in Fort O since liquor by the drink was instituted under his watch.

As Adolf Hitler said, if you tell a big enough lie long enough, people will believe it.
 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/21/2007 09:53:28 PM
who cares....what would you rather them be doing? shaking doorknobs?
 
HermanSnerdIII
Comments: 11
Joined: 07/24/2007
11/21/2007 09:49:53 PM
Amazing to me is that Judege Donnie Peppers wasn't included in Rome's post from News Channel 9. How soon we all forget and it would appear to have been washed away from his record completely.

Hoosier, just to clarify... I am all too aware that LE has to come from time to time to the hospital ER for official business... One only has to watch an officer conducting himself in that scenario to know the difference. Trust me when I say, that was not the case on the nights in question. Officers do not leave someone that they have in custody to follow a nurse through the nurse's station and into the back of the ER when they are on official business, nor do they sit at the nurse's desk in the nurses station when they are on official business. When that is the case (for official purposes), all officers act in a manner that is both professional, and courteous. Neither was happening that night.

 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/21/2007 07:19:43 PM
If I recall correctly, wasn't Mayor Burkhart's wife (or former wife, by now) arrested for DUI. I believe that it was only a year or so ago. Gee, I wonder if she whittled hers down to...what is the reduced charge again...oh yeah...reckless conduct?!

At the last council meeting Egeland questioned Chief Black about a reduction of charges in the Botts case. I remember a lot of silence....and then...............a simple little, "Because" passing from the lips of the City Manager/Attorney Extraordinaire, Goulart, himself.

I guess the question remains, how much damage can the city of FO sustain before the new administration comes in January?

 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/21/2007 06:56:43 PM
hoosier,,,,it's just a legal requirement, to allow the city an opportunity to "right the wrong" prior to the inevitable lawsuit. Once goulart screws that up, then the lawsuit can go ahead.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/21/2007 06:45:55 PM
.....and now I read the breaking news that Chief Black is appealing his suspension. However, the really weird thing is that he has to address his appeal to Goulart who is the very person who suspended him in the first place. Is the because his dual positions with the city as City Manager/City Attorney come into play? WOW, I bet that is going to be a fair and unbiased review of the facts!!! ............the saga continues...............
 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/21/2007 05:55:57 PM
What in the world are you people doing up there? From a News Channel 9 investigation.......

It appears drunk drivers have been getting a slap on the wrist in Fort Oglethorpe.
Our investigative team researched more than 300 records and found a KEY loophole in the law.
We found that almost 4 out of every 10 accused drunk drivers received reductions.
We're talking about reductions that DO NOT go on your driving record.
Police officers made legitimate stops, but those changed in Fort Oglethorpe city court.


"Second offense, drinking and disorderly, two offenses, three obstructions."
Solicitor Pat Clements spells out the charges against a man in Fort Oglethorpe city court.
The man gets 10 days in jail for his second DUI, two years probation and hefty fines for all his violations.
But records show that's not an ACCURATE picture of what happens to DUI charges in this court.
Our investigative team examined every DUI stop from 2005 through June of this year.
We found some startling patterns.
The dismissal judgment appears frequently, but NOT NEARLY as often as reckless conduct reduction.
Our investigation shows 37 percent of every DUI
stop gets reduced to the lesser offense of reckless conduct.
We found multiple examples where the blood alcohol level stood more than two times the legal level of point zero eight but the driver gets the lighter judgment.
We SPENT three full days poring over 300 records
nd found cases of drivers almost THREE times the legal limit and walking out of court without a DUI.
We took our research to one of the two judges who signed off on these reductions.
We pointed out cases with blood alcohol levels of .220. .206. and cases three times the blood alcohol level. Judge Norris said, "Gosh, the recommendation that I take is always from the attorney that's here that brings it in, brings it up and brings it out to what's there."
That attorney is solicitor Pat Clements, who is elected and functions like a district attorney, but in this lower court.

We tracked him down after court, showed him some of our research and told him the judge's answer.
He clearly didn't want to talk about it.
Clements said, "Without looking at the case, I can't tell you anything."

After digging through these records, we found out how severely drunk drivers benefit in Fort Oglethorpe's city court.
Attorney Amy Petulla specializes in DUI law.
She's defended many people on that charge in north Georgia. She provided perspective.
"With reckless conduct, it doesn't go on your license, it doesn't go on your insurance and you don't wind up getting your license suspended obviously," Petulla said.
We showed her these specific numbers.
In 2005, Fort Oglethorpe's court reduced 51 out of 124 DUI stops to reckless conduct.
In 2006, 60 out of 139 got the lighter judgment.
And this year, the trend slowed down. Through June, only seven out of 38 were reduced to reckless conduct.
We asked her if that was a loophole in the system to beat DUI. "Reckless conduct is one of those broad, vague sort of laws. It'w not just DUI that it's there for. That's one of those charges that can be a loophole for a lot of different areas," Petulla said.


Granted many of the dismissals and reductions ell right at the legal fblood alcohol level.
But how do police officers feel about drivers THREE times over the limit getting off the hook?
Detective David Eubanks said, "If you are a newer, less seasoned officer, it's going to have more affect on you. It might make you stop and think and wonder if you're ever going to write another ticket, to be honest."


We wanted to take our questions to the top with Fort Oglethorpe police chief Larry Black.
But city manager Ron Goulart would not allow us to speak with Chief Black.
Goulart selected Detective David Eubanks for our interview.
We asked him if all the reductions made stops seem in vain.
Detective Eubanks said, "Well, certainly it has an affect. Like I said, on younger inexperienced officers. But if you do this day in and day out, you have to accept that some of your cases are not going to stick."

Judge Norris offered this perspective on the charges that fall.
Judge Norris said, "You know as well as I do in the city of Chattanooga, or out here anywhere else, alcohol is a big time thing. And we try our best to do what we can to do that. We try our best to do what we can to do that, to keep them away from it up there. I'm not perfect, I'll be honest with you about that. And I don't try to do that just to take money."

Judge Norris is referring to the fines levied on reductions to reckless conduct.
During our research we found, 991 dollars was the standard fine for DUI.
When reduced to reckless conduct, many times that fine jumps up to two, three or even five thousand dollars.
We are still working to determine exactly where that money goes.

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION
FORT OGLETHORPE DUI STATS

2005
DUI Arrests 124
Guilty 70
Charge Reduced to Reckless Conduct 51
Transferred to Superior Court 3


2006
DUI Arrests 139
Guilty 71
Charge Reduced to Reckless Conduct 60
Transferred to Superior Court 8



2007 (through June 30th)
DUI Arrests 38
Guilty 27
Charge Reduced to Reckless Conduct 7
Transferred to Superior Court 4

*************************************

Of the 118 DUI charges that were reduced to Reckless Conduct from January 2005 through June 2007, the following 25 cases involved suspects with blood alcohol levels more than twice the legal limit of .80:

01/01/05 Carol Davian McCoy .173

01/02/05 Miguel Bernabe Remundo .225

01/08/05 Tommy James Hudgins .247

01/29/05 Robert Lee Adams, Jr. .171

03/27/05 Terry Eugene Burnette .165

05/01/05 Jason Melendes-Castro .182

05/05/05 Christopher Ray Dowden .178

05/14/05 Jacob Alan Walker .167

05/25/05 Jaysen Allen Smith .186

07/23/05 Michael Morris Steele .175

08/04/05 Stephen Dewayne Cross .161

08/12/05 Becky Lavonne Griffin .191

08/25/05 Jane Kathleen Brock .200

08/26/05 Zakari Scott Webb .195

08/28/05 Billy Shaw Ezell, Jr. .186

10/07/05 James Robin Leach, Jr. .170

10/27/05 Theresa Marie Eason .195

10/31/05 Joseph Lebron Adams, Jr. .161

11/23/05 Philip Thomas Papson .176

12/08/05 Troy Lamar Wimpy .169

02/05/06 Christopher Eric Hawkins .220

04/28/06 Willy Lee Gunter .256

05/13/06 Eric Blankenbaker .206

06/04/06 Edgardo Santiago Melendez .246




 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/20/2007 08:18:43 PM
Herman, I work at Hutcheson and even though I do not spend my entire shift in the Emergency Room, I do spend a good amount of time there. Although I do not have specifics as to the evening you are referring to or the officer in question, I do want to state that frequently police officers are in the ER in the line of duty. For instance, they may have someone in their custody that has been involved in a car accident that is suspected of DUI, etc. etc. In most cases, medical treatment can take hours instead of minutes which can explain in many cases a long legnth of stay. Anyway, I just wanted to throw out the possibility that perhaps the officer in question was there for legitimate reasons.

 
juga
Comments: 304
Joined: 02/05/2007
11/19/2007 06:09:50 AM
Rabbit, my point was this: when supervisors get calls or read on blogs such as this, etc, there is nothing they can do because they do not know who it is. There are so many people will complain on LE, but when it is time to really "put the money where their mouth is" things change. I do believe there are many good officers in Ft.O. I just wish people who continue to complain on LE would just go forward and file the complaint if they strongly believe in it instead of hiding behind a blog or t.v. station. How many times have you heard LE hiding behind their badge? Many people criticize and complain but if they had to identify themselves the story becomes a little different.
 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/18/2007 09:33:57 PM
God forbid you file a formal complaint. All hell will break loose... and as you said, juga, supervisors hear these things all the time (and I read into that not much comes of it). Still, all in all, we do have a good crop of peace officers in FO and we shouldn't let a few rotten apples spoil the rest.

Oh, sorry, I was channeling Judy O...

 
juga
Comments: 304
Joined: 02/05/2007
11/18/2007 03:50:24 PM
Herman If you see this sort of things happening, you should go to the FOPD and file a formal complaint. I see for myself in many areas where officers are going too fast, putting others in harms way and yet will pull a citizen over for some minor something. Supervisors and higher ups know these things go on and hear it daily. The problem is unless a formal complaint with officer name really there is nothing that one can do.

 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/18/2007 03:01:52 PM
lol snerd...yeah, maybe they'll fire 'em all and they'll have the horrible task of finding another job that pays 11 dollars an hour.
 
HermanSnerdIII
Comments: 11
Joined: 07/24/2007
11/18/2007 01:28:02 PM
Fort Oglethorpe needs to get a hold on some of their renegade Police Officers... Last night, I saw a FOPD officer bust through the red light at Hwy2 and 27, nearly causing a major pileup at that intersection to pull over a car. Now, I am sure that the car being pursued was deserving of attention of the LE, but jeopardizing public safety to give said attention is not the way to go about it. I am a public servant as well, I also know that there is a standard called "Due Regard for Public Safety." That was definately not observed. I will tell you something else as well. One only needs to go to Hutcheson on a particular Lieutenant's (initials are K.W. for those who want to know who I refer to) shift to see that FO is not nearly as protected as one might think it is at night. I have been at the hospital on a couple of occasions during the last week, and this particular Lt. and his other two road officers were more interested in chasing nurses at the Emergency Room, (inhibiting them from doing their jobs), drinking coffee, shooting the bull with the hospital security officers (inhibiting them as well from doing their jobs) than they were about protecting the good citizens of F.O. I promise you this however. This is not a 5 minute deal, I am talking about hours at a time. The next time I see this taking place, I am going to break out my camera and start snapping dated and timed pictures, and then the elected officials can answer to the reasons why this has become a habit of theirs.

 
sleepingbeauty
Comments: 19
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/16/2007 08:29:53 PM
RabbitNFO, you got my vote too! All for seeing you as one of revolving co-hosts!! Anything beats The Ronnie Cobb hour(sorry couldn't resist):)
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/16/2007 07:12:31 PM
Rabbit, I believe I recall that Judy DID agree to meet with Goulart, however, she said something to the effect that it couldn't be for a couple of days because she was busy. I also recall her joking around about taking Roger, too, but I was also under the impression that she was to meet with him at some point in time.

Kind of caught me by surprise that you, Rabbit, became the topic of the evening (if only for a brief moment.) Hey, maybe you can become another one of her revolving "cohosts". I do believe that would make for an interesting evening. :-)

Kudos to Judy for this much....when I relocated to this area 5 years ago, I tuned in to UCTV as much as I was able. I learned so much about the area and it helped my family and I settle in much easier.
 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/16/2007 06:13:05 PM
I just thought of something. Judy O, as she read my post on-air last night, denied she accepted Goulart's offer for her to come to his office. Actually (and you know I hate admitting this), she may be right. She didn't come right out and say she would go, but she did joke about it and tell Roger she was going to take him and that she might even record it. I just assumed she would go.

But Judy, why wouldn't you want to go? Why after having given a forum on your show for everyone to comment (including you sharing your opinions along with Roger and intimating that you knew the real truth). This goes to my point. You don't want to give equal time to both sides, regardless if you disagree with it.

So please, Judy O (and no, I don't know you), go to Goulart's office and find out what he has to say and the proof he has and share it with the public. If not, let it go.

Signed,
A fan of Sassy Goat Milk

(we need a spellcheck on here, especially now that Judy O might read these on-air)
 
sleepingbeauty
Comments: 19
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/16/2007 08:06:09 AM
Why didn't we hear weeks & weeks of coverage on the Sassy Goat Milk Hour about Chiefs Blevins,Wyrick and Howell? Where was the FOP to help them?

 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/16/2007 12:07:45 AM
[Ugly comment edited by user]

Okay, that was catty and I apologize. But in other FO news, I have now made the Sassy Goat Milk show. Actually, I think our little happy home on the web will never be the same. Swoon....

Look, I agree the whole seat belt case is a load of bunk. I don't know the officer, or the person who got pulled over. I don't know either's histories and it doesn't matter. If the Po Po pulls you over for a seatbelt violation, pay your $15, drive through, have a nice day. If you want to complain, then go to court (and pay your $15, drive through, have a nice day).
 
CSS4Comm4
Comments: 160
Joined: 10/09/2006
11/15/2007 09:58:24 PM
***If you want to donate to the Larry Black Suspension Fund, to compensate Chief Black for his unpaid suspension, you can stop by any Northwest Georgia Bank and make a donation. If Chief Black refuses to accept the money, or if the collection is more than what covers his salary for the two weeks, the excess money will be donated to the Stockings Full of Love program at the Walker and Catoosa County Sheriff's Departments.***

By the way, I heard about this on the "Judy O, Sassy Goat Milk Soap, Liberal Democrat" Show. Of course, many of her co-hosts would strongly disagree with that "Liberal Democrat" label.
 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/15/2007 07:43:01 PM
please, when i said "you", I didn't mean YOU......lol

I could see how you would think that, but if you re-read the last paragraph and see that prior to using "YOU", I said "people like that" (obviously excluding you) and when you use a pronoun, it usually refers to the previous identifier, in that case, people who turn seatbelt tickets into a political issue. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Most police that I know HATE writing seatbelt tickets....1st of all it's 15 dollar fine so that tells ya right there that the state is not very serious about enforcing seatbelt laws.......2nd it's one of those "he said/he said" tickets......3rd if you see someone obviously without their seatbelt on, you write it....if it just "appears" that it's not on, don't waste your time even stopping them......things they look for? color of seatbelt vs. color of your shirt...if you have a yellow shirt on, and the seatbelt is red, it's pretty obvious if you have it on or not....and seatbelts are usually enforced in areas where the traffic is slow or even at stop locations so that they can get a good look at you...........the best ones, and happens very often, is seeing the buckle hanging up by the driver's head.

Here's the true test. how many on here have gotten speeding tickets? I'd say lots......How many of you called the City manager and demanded he sign a petition telling the police to quit harassing citizens? I doubt any of you.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/15/2007 07:20:25 PM
Rabbit, silly, but funny nonetheless. Seriously, though, I would have thought that all of the upward (then, downward) mobility in pay grade would have reeked havoc within the department, causing all kinds of problems between folks, but, instead it almost looks like it ensured more comraderie. I must admit that I really admire this police dept. after watching them having to put up with all of the nonsense and then to still perform their duties as professionally as they do. This, of course, is just the opinion of an outsider.

Would I be correct in assuming that the shortest-lived City Manager would be the one that resigned before he relocated here? You know the one that was told there were enough votes to fire him once he actually came here to do the job. Just exactly how long did he hold the position.....a week?! Good grief....you just can't make this stuff up!!!
 
please
Comments: 128
Joined: 08/17/2007
11/15/2007 06:55:55 PM
Rome and others: First, you don't know me or my children or how I raised them and saying it's No wonder they turned out how they did is completely unfair. My children were raised to respect all authority and have never been in any trouble. My father was a police office and my father in law died in active duty in the Air Force. My children voiced no opinion - so attack me - not them.

Second - my problem is not with arresting the guy with gun at the liquor store. My problem is when the cops get there after the liquor store owner is shot and the guy is gone. Detective John stands over the suffering man and says "you know, I just don't believe it happened the way you say". Well, guess what? Liquor store Joe might be a bit dazed with a .38 slug in him for a day or two. It might be that he can't get the details to you right then. Sorry about that. Don't stand over him and call him a liar. That is the bad attitude cop I'm objecting to.

Third, and for the record, the reason I consulted with an attorney, I WAS the crime victim, not the perpetrator. It seems I have been placed in the scumbag column just because of my opinion, and so have my children. Again, that is the attitude I object to - but don't worry. I will never voice an opinion here again.
 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/15/2007 06:43:37 PM
catvoter: I stand corrected about the SPLOST shares. I think we (FO) could do more with the money. This streetscaping stuff probably needs to be in there somewhere, but certainly not at the top of the list. When you drive down Battfield Pkwy, please slow down and notice our wonderful benches and victorian era sidewalk lighting. Hell, stop your car if you'd like and have a sit. Someone needs to use those things. :)

hoosier - who would want to take any appointed position?!? I am equally worried about our prospects for city manager. Ok, I know this is silly, but I wonder if when an FO Chief is 'sent back down to the minors' do they check to see who was in office longer then high-five each other?!? I know.. I said it was silly.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/15/2007 06:39:20 PM
Trevan, I have the same concern as you. Who in the world would want to take over the Police Chief job? My understanding that there are already quite a few FORMER F.O. police chiefs still in the dept. Isn't it four or five? I don't believe that is something that would normally transpire in your average police dept.
 
catvoter
Comments: 100
Joined: 08/10/2007
11/15/2007 06:35:54 PM
If Black can stay professional and calm, he may be the steadying body in a new era after the first of the year.

Goulart is not a long term candidate even if he has the three votes. He simply is not smooth enough to wisely manage people. He will have one crisis after another. Self generated chaos. FO cannot afford to let him keep stirring up trouble.

The future growth in the FO area requires tact in working with the County and Ringgold. Goulart doesn't stand a chance, he doesn't know how to work with a team.

Look how smoothly Ringgold is spending County SPLOST money on sewers and other projects. FO is way behind.

Rabbit --- SPLOST money is somewhat based on population and has nothing to do with where the sales tax dollars are generated. I think CCNews said once that the County gets (approx.) about 75%, FO about 13-14%, Ringgold about 4% and Catoosa Utility about 8%. Believe those percenages were negotiated way back when SPLOST first got going. Ringgold would love to get a share based on where collected. I would wager that I-75 and the car dealers generate more than FO. Who would know?

It is that 75% that the County spreads out and approves for things like the ball fields and big sewer projects that Goulart has no ability to negotiate for in the future SPLOSTs. The FO bluster and squeaky wheel may get the grease (or KY) but won't get the cash.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/15/2007 06:31:47 PM
Rabbit, I think you may be spot on with your comment about Judy O's agenda concerning Dinley. I have had the feeling for some time that may have been the case. With that being said, however, what a great idea!!!! Dinley appeared to me to be extremely professional, knowledgable and capable in his position. Sure would be a far cry from the current City Manager now.

Sorry for the hijack....back to the subject at hand............
 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/15/2007 06:26:18 PM
rome - I hate to admit it but I am tired of hearing Mrs Botts complain that her husband is a business man and has done business with the city for blah blah blah years. The fact is, he as a business man should have known better.

Soccer moms, business men, little old ladies who only drive to church on Sundays and teenagers are all subject to the same traffic laws and the same due process. If the charge was a printable offense, then off to the stoney lonesome he should have gone.

Oh, Lord. I'm starting to sound like Judy and Roger. I should hush now.
 
mollieollie
Comments: 227
Joined: 04/13/2007
11/15/2007 06:06:09 PM
Amen, Juga, Sister, Brother!!!!! you are preaching to the choir!!!!! I have heard for a long time FO police pull you over for nothing!!! well one person in particular was the biggest complainer. His family and friends as well. But you know what?, everytime I saw the person out, they were gunning their motor, spinning their tires, wanting the citizens attention, but noooo.... not the cops. I appreciate the times my children were pulled over for speeding, it could have saved their lives. I have to admitt (I promise, If I am lying I'm dying) that I have deserved a ticket lots of times, that I didn't get it. Every ticket I got I deserved . Most of us do. Have a wonderful evening!!!
MO
 
juga
Comments: 304
Joined: 02/05/2007
11/15/2007 05:53:26 PM
Rome, I feel very passionate about it. I just get so tired of citizens bashing LE everytime they get pulled over or reprimanded in any way. Yes, I am sure there are LE who do wrong; I don't doubt it in the least. But this case is all about politcs and there is no other way to look at it. The majority of LE are in the business and are dedicated to the protect and to serve. Each one is on duty with his/her life at the mercy of every citizen they come in contact with. There isn't time to decide if dude is telling the truth or if the officer's life is at stake. Decisions have to be made in split seconds. I am sure you know all of this. I just don't think it is fair for people to criticize an officer for giving someone a ticket for no seat belt or speeding, etc. These same officers are the ones who will protect when a call is made or help when a car is broken down,etc.

I think people should attack the politicians and get it all out with them and not include LE when they are just doing there job!
 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/15/2007 05:17:03 PM
juga, bravo to your last paragraph.
Sarah, it's funny to read what you read, but from a professional cops point of view, here's what they see........The Same person who sees them loading a long-haired scummy guy in the patrol car and thinks to themselves "I bet they stopped him because of the way he looks...that's not right, they shouldn't judge people by their looks"; are the SAME people who get pulled over and just can't believe the cops would mess with a business person in a nice car on their way home from work.
 
juga
Comments: 304
Joined: 02/05/2007
11/15/2007 03:14:16 PM
I agree with all that has been said. It really unnerves me for people to start bashing LE when something happens such as one of their own or themselves gets a ticket. I have been guilty of speeding manytimes, but didn't get caught. I can't believe the jerks of cops didn't pull me over and give me a ticket. LOL. What some of these people are saying sound just as crazy.

So many people don't want to take responsibilities for their action. So many times they cry about someone comes to there defense and they think they can get off. Our jails are full from people continue to break the law and not taking responsibility. They thought somebody was going to get them out of it when they cried. What is so sad is that so many parents are this way and they are teaching their children to be this way. We need to stop this horrible cycle. I feel so sorry for teachers. So many parents are ready to put the teacher on the chopping block when they try to teach the child a little respect and responsibility. In that case, maybe they should go ahead and order their inmate's uniform.
 
Sarah27728
Comments: 126
Joined: 10/23/2007
11/15/2007 03:11:09 PM
It was just a seatbelt ticket. What a crybaby.

i do believe cops shouldnt pick out the people they dislike and 'have fun' with them, though.

 
asif
Comments: 19
Joined: 11/15/2007
11/15/2007 02:42:21 PM
Romegasir!!!!! very well said!!!!! you are a wise man!!!! like reading your posts on every issue! you make a lot of sense!!!
 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/15/2007 02:33:58 PM
Please, good cops do not give "benefit of the doubt".....that's what gets them killed, that's what makes them the type of cops that criminals love (the kind they get over on).....the benefit of the doubt, and innocent til proven guilty is for court, not for the streets.........In your world, a cop sees man in liquor store with gun, cop should assuming that the clerk had attacked the man with gun and man with gun is defending himself. In your world, everytime a cop stops someone for a traffic violation and person says "I wasn't speeding" or "I had my seatbelt on"....cop should think "well, hmmmmm, maybe I'm wrong." In your world, cop suspects someone of crime, cop should just ask and trust that the suspect will tell the truth.......Did you steal that car? No sir, I found it.......okay then, have a nice day.

Good cops are suspicious, nosy, and could give a crap less about hurting your feelings, winning your support or being on the upside of the latest opinion poll.

you know, if you get pulled over for not wearing your seatbelt, and it turns out the officer was mistaken, go to court...if you lose, pay $15, if you don't then celebrate............what type of person turns that into a political issue........I know his type, I dealt with him for a decade....I quit law enforcement so that I could earn a decent living, but swore to myself when I did, that NOW that I don't have to cow-tow to the likes of people like that, I would say what's on my mind, and it's NO WONDER your children turn out the way that they do.
 
asif
Comments: 19
Joined: 11/15/2007
11/15/2007 01:59:36 PM
Correct Juga!!! just look at Walker Co. records, this same person has been pulled over in walker co for the same thing. It appears that Judy Oneal is getting blamed for things that any news person could air, Who knows who is right? I know there are always two sides to the story, but on one hand you have people in charge going to chattanooga news people with THEIR side, then you have others calling in or going to Judy. It is this very thing that divides people. This is to Please, I say you are correct that Larry B will learn from this, MY hope is , he and all the FO police Don't say, we will go somewhere else and find a job, we can't do our job for ALL the citizens, because they may know the mayor or someone that will reverse the policemans attempt to protect and serve. Any official should not let themselves become involved in a police matter with someone they are in business with, a relative, or a close friend. It is wrong, and that is why the people have voted them out of office. Talk about childs play, it is nothing but being spitefull. I hope someone does find out how some of the officials have managed to put money in their pockets off the citizens. This should have never come out in the news. If it was handled like men, it could have been resolved. and as for non citizens being at the last meeting, no wonder, it was a free entertainment night. Like, look, watch the big man lie, look at the other man get mad for something he has done but no one else can get by with it. It was easy to leave that meeting with HUH????
Now they have tarnished the city with bad publicity and drug good mens names through the mud and made themselves look like total idiots. My goodness! stop ! regain some dignity before you leave office.

 
juga
Comments: 304
Joined: 02/05/2007
11/15/2007 01:03:02 PM
Please you know as well as I do this has nothing to do with LE doing what is right and fair. Chief Black is the one who is having to take all the slander for what is going on in politics. Very few LE officers wake up and go to work planning on who they can humiliate and wrongly accuse. There are enough criminals out there that they don't have to. It is always funny to listen to stories of officers. When they stop someone, they always have an emergency, or no that wasn't mine , or no I don't anything about it. Very rarely is an officer going to accuse someone of something they didn't do. First of all, there is job is so demanding they don't have time for that and plus they don't want to go through unnecessary hassle. Every bit of this nonsense is about politics. If Officer Higgins said the man didn't have a seat belt on, I am sure didn't. This man is known for complaining and it isn't the first time he has had a run in like this and it isn't the first time he is playing the innocent game.

People want officers to hurry and get to their rescue when they need some protection or help, but let them do their job of enforcing law that they didn't make and all of sudden they are jerks.

 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/15/2007 12:32:52 PM
Please - as I sit here wiping the tears from eyes from laughing, all I can say is maybe THAT will get his attention.
 
please
Comments: 128
Joined: 08/17/2007
11/15/2007 09:56:15 AM
The upside to all this is the Mr. Black could learn a valuable lesson. He could learn the innocent people do get accused and blamed for things unjustly. He could learn to treat people with respect. He could learn that even someone under suspicion deserves to be treated as innocent until proven guilty. He could also teach he officers not to assume that everyone they meet is a liar. He could come back and say "this was not right that I was treated this way" and I'm going to see to it that no one, citizen or police officer every has to feel this way in Fort O again. Experience is a good teacher.
 
Trevan
Comments: 54
Joined: 01/03/2007
11/15/2007 03:02:36 AM
F.O. is on the verge of losing perhaps the best and most qualified Chief they've had there in the past 20 years.

Worst case.. Larry leaves, or is asked to leave. Now what? Who in their right mind would take that job? The police dept, and I assume it's under the city charter, have been tasked to upholding the laws to the best of their ability. Larry has done all he can.

If the Chief's job becomes vacant, who would fill it? They'll either fight with the counsil, or be their puppet. Too bad. There are some really great cops that work there, and they're stuck in the middle.

Soooooo, what's the upside to all of this?
 
RabbitNFO
Comments: 37
Joined: 10/30/2007
11/15/2007 02:21:44 AM
Good grief, people. If the council wanted to fire Black, they could do it now (they have the votes if you believe the hype) and do it WITHOUT CAUSE. If Goulart wanted to fire Black, he could also do it, but would have to show cause. If Black was insubordinate, then he should have gotten disciplinary action. Before I jump the gun and picket, I want to know more. I don't simply go on Judy O's say so.

Speaking of Judy O, has anyone noticed that Ronnie Cobb has co-hosted twice in the last week? And Judy says she isn't biased? OH PLEASE... This isn't a slam towards Cobb, just Judy. I for one am tired of her downing the council and actually FO in general.

Goulart invited Judy to his office to clear up the Botts issue and she accepted. Did she show? NO. Why not? Goulart explained that he had 2 emails from Black asking him to look into the situation. She doesn't want to hear the truth, much less give equal time to clearing up the uproar she helped to cause. Judy has now dropped that issue and gone on to another one. I think I now see her agenda a little more clearly, getting Dinley back as city manager. She stirs up more (for ratings? for personal gain? to stay 'in the know?) than anyone on the council has.

Do I think the council members and city manager and mayor and chief of police are alter boys? Lord, no. But I would like to find out more details from something more reliable than the Sassy Goat Milk show. And as for the two preachers on the council, Brandon and Hamm are their names, MIA. I find it hard for anyone to know what is in their hearts if they have not met them, much less know their names. As for the crowd at the city council meeting, someone should have taken a head count of how many were actually FO residents. I think you would be surprised. FOP #99's membership is mostly county and state. Even Silcox 'welcomed' the visitors to the city.

While I am on my soapbox, what the hell was Egeland thinking berating Red Smith by saying he was a loser and a disgrace to his uniform? As I have pointed out time and time again, the man is a hot head. He needs to do some self-examination as to why he lost his race.

Rome, I like your style, sir!

Catvoter, FO is getting roughly 18% of the county's overall SPLOST funds.
(q.v. http://www.catoosa.com/depts/tax/splost/splost-project-summary.htm).
FO is 14.5% of Catoosa County's population according to the 2005 census estimates.
(q.v. http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/13/13047.html)
But SPLOST money is, as I am sure someone will point out, allocated not by population but by revenue base (sales tax revenue). I don't know the numbers there but I think FO's SPLOST ask is in line.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/14/2007 08:53:32 PM
lee2854, I do remember a lot of uproar over Dinley's recent firing so I don't think Chief Black is the first one to garner this much attention from the public. Perhaps it is time for 'people to get riled up,' before the citizens of FO are stuck with nothing but the bottom-feeders running their city.
 
hoosiermama
Comments: 401
Joined: 11/14/2007
11/14/2007 08:47:29 PM
acitizen, I don't believe I could have worded it any better than you. I am NOT a resident of F. O., but I work there and spend a lot of my time there. If there are any plans in the making as far as picketing city hall or petitions or anything of the like, please count me in.

Unfortunately, it appears that disciplinary action is not where this action towards Chief Black is going to end and even if it were, I don't see why HIS career or reputation should suffer at the expense of some of these high-and-mighty politicians. This type of non-sense needs to stop and stop right now....not in January!
 
lee2854
Comments: 19
Joined: 09/07/2007
11/14/2007 08:40:03 PM
Disciplinary action is disciplinary action not firing....I don't remember this much uproar about others who were disciplined without substantial reason...picking and choosing who is like is wrong of non citizens....get over it people and listen to the reason instead of jumping to conclusions.....

People of this area are so judgmental and I am not even a fan of any politician or attorney or city manager, but don't be so judgmental of everyone. Mia you seem to be out of line suggesting you know the heart of two men on the council that are preachers....judgment is not left to us so don't do it. I have realized since last week that I should not be judgmental so just think about it before everyone goes running off at the mouth like Judy does on television and gets people riled up.
 
acitizen
Comments: 2
Joined: 11/05/2007
11/14/2007 08:18:46 PM
I wonder at what point the citizens of Fort Oglethorpe are going to have enough of Mr. Goulart's power hungry dictatorship and decide to take back their city? I am beginning to wonder if soon we may be traveling through the city of Goulart instead of Fort Oglethorpe...

I commend Chief Black for not only maintaining his professionalism throughout this witch hunt but for also standing behind the officers that have been publicly humiliated and ridiculed as a direct result of Mr. Goulart's political agenda. I believe Chief Black has maintained throughout this ordeal with both officers that neither did anything other than their jobs and turns out Chief - you were right.

I also wonder what exactly Mr. Goulart means when he says that he "hopes it get his attention"? I believe Mr. Goulart, you have not only his attention but everyone else's within about a hundred mile radius and we are all wondering if you're really a total idiot or if maybe your judgement is clouded by all the alcohol you consume? I am sorry to be so harsh but I suppose that's no harsher than the things you've said about the officers that serve Fort Oglethorpe.

Good job, Mr. Goulart you've got everyone's attention - go ahead and continue to prove YOUR incompetance with some more POOR JUDGEMENT calls.

I wonder who within that city really needs some sensitivity training? How sensitive is it to submit these officers to public scrutiny for nothing more than doing EXACTLY what they are paid to do? It may be wise to turn our attention away from the poor guys just trying to do their jobs and instead turn it to the folks at city hall who apparently have enough time on their hands to constantly give tv and newspaper interviews trashing officers at FOPD... Does Mr. Goulart not have anything else do do while at work?

 
romegasir
Comments: 1608
Joined: 03/14/2007
11/14/2007 06:39:48 PM
If you can get enough people, for the time being, picket city hall, have all the supporters sign a petition demanding that the current council get rid of Goulart, ensure the petition says that if he is not removed by the second month of the new council taking office, all of the ones who signed the current petition will sign a new petition for recall of the new candidates......if any of the current council own or work at local businesses, boycott them too.

the fact that you get pulled over and "claim" that you had your seatbelt on (yeah right), is a matter for court, not for an internal affairs investigation. What, are they gonna start opening an investigation everytime a criminal pleas not guilty?

I know our local department is about 14 to 15 officers short.......I'm sure they'd LOVE to have certified officers willing to actually do their jobs even when it involves the city manager's friends.

Lastly, pray that Chief Black files a grievance, expects to lose, and then files it in Superior Court.

 
catvoter
Comments: 100
Joined: 08/10/2007
11/14/2007 05:29:06 PM
I also don't live in Ft. O but have followed their plight. No surprises in the election. Anyone looking in from the outside could see the purge coming. Now that needs to continue to purge the City Manager/Attorney spot. Everyone in the County knows Larry Black is the true professional, non-political, works well with the Democrats, Republicans, Independents, etc.

What kind of cooperation will this City Manager get from the County on completing sewer projects, ball fields, roads, and everything else that needs County controlled SPLOST money. Judd seemed to forget that FO is only 20% of the County at most, and he had nothing to bring to the table in negotiations. He should have brought "hat in hand" with respect.

The City Manager should get 4 weeks suspension from the City Council for creating this havoc. I hope Larry Black files a grievence and ends up with two weeks vacation with pay.

FO, rise up and let the Council know where you stand.
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